Welcome to the defender podcast, a resource to help mobilize and equip the body of Christ to manifest the gospel to orphans and vulnerable children. This podcast is a ministry of Lifeline Children Services, and I'm your host, Herbie Newell. It's Wednesday, October 9, 2024, and doctor Rick and I are coming to you from Birmingham, Alabama, where today we are joined by the one and only pastor Chris Johnson, also known as the Michael Jordan of all pastors. Pastor Chris joined Lifeline in March 2020, and he serves as a senior director of church partnerships and external advocacy. Before coming to Lifeline, he had served as a pastor for 24 years and as the executive director of the Kentucky's Governor's Office of Faith Based and Community Based Initiatives.

Pastor Chris has also served as a consultant has been a frequent speaker at local, state, and national conferences, churches, and community gatherings, sharing his family's story and challenging others to answer the gospel call to care for the vulnerable child and vulnerable families. He was born and raised in Metro ATL and currently lives in Birmingham. Chris and his wife, Alicia, who we also like to refer to as the first lady, they have 10 children, 7 whom came to their home through foster care, and their home has also been a home to, over 40 children in foster care. They also have 3 grandchildren, 2 whom they've adopted through foster care. For fun, Chris likes reading, spending time with his family, and when he can find a win, he enjoys cheering for the Georgia Tech Yellow Jackets.

So we're really grateful to have pastor Chris here, as we said, the Michael Jordan of all pastors to talk about something that's upcoming in the month of November and that is orphan Sunday. And orphan Sunday is a powerful opportunity for your church to raise awareness and take action on behalf of the fatherless. Lifeline Children Services is here to help you speak up for the voiceless, providing everything you need to equip your church from videos and slides to prayer cards, sermon guides, and small group materials. Lifeline's resource page is packed with tools to help your congregation respond to the plight of the 140,000,000 orphan and vulnerable children around the world. So we invite you to partner with us this orphan Sunday.

And if you'd like a speaker to share this message at your church, all of Lifeline's team, especially our leaders, are ready, willing, and available, including pastor Chris himself or or doctor Rick or Blake Wilson or any of our great speakers, even my myself, Herbie Newell would love to come and be there to inspire your congregation from the word to defend the vulnerable and respond to God's call to care. So visit lifelinechild.org backslash orphan. Again, that's lifelinechild.org backslash orphan to access these resources and to book a speaker and to learn more about how you can get involved. And as always, you can see our show notes. Well, it's that time of the podcast when both doctor Rick and I are here that I have the opportunity, to bring on the venerable doctor Rick, the one with the silver hair and the silver tongue.

I know for the last several weeks, he's been doing this alone. Grateful to be back. Grateful to give you the just introduction that you are due, doctor Rick. Been really lonely.

It's been been tough by myself here, so I'm I'm glad you're back. We're we're we're crossing in the wind. I'm not sure when I'm gonna see you again, but it's, it's good to see you today. Yeah.

It feels like, at the time of this recording, it may be a good 3 weeks before we see each

other. That is that is legitimately true, probably from the point that we walk out of this room. So well, I have some late breaking news. The Johnson's added 3 more grandchildren while we were sitting here. So,

Well, I feel like, really, if you talk about it, the Johnsons are adding pretty much a grandchild a day. I did realize as I was reading that lengthy bio that there was some there were some mistakes in there. Not not mistakes for when it was written, but mistakes catching us up to time.

That's right.

As they say, in most things, like, when you're thinking about, like, your house and your stuff, keeping up with the Joneses, if you're thinking about children, we're keeping up with the Johnsons. No doubt.

Some of us have just tapped out. We've completely given up.

Very wisely very wisely tapped out.

Well, you know, so, I, like, I feel silly welcoming you to the podcast, but, Chris, we're glad to have you here.

Glad to be here. Glad to be a part. Always a joy to be able to be included in the room with you guys. Well, it's

not his first time, and we even had one time that we had the first lady herself Absolutely. Alicia Johnson join us as well.

As a matter of fact, probably most of the folks that are listening to us now have sighed and and are a little sad that she's not here.

Yes. For real.

Because she keep this crew on on the rails today. We know

that The matter is, as it's been, pastor Chris has probably been on the Defender podcast since I've been on the Defender podcast. That really

is that's legitimately possible. I'm not sure that you've done have we done an episode together this year?

I don't know.

Well, so, you know, so topic of discussion today is Orphan Sunday and we, you know, this has been a fixture in our lane of ministry for, you know, for a while and we all know the story. Maybe you don't know the story and so I'll give you, you know, we'll have a quick history lesson that Orphan Sunday started actually in Zambia about 15 years ago. Our our friend, Billy Chondwe, who is was pastor in, Kalingalinga, Zambia.

Say that four times real fast. I cannot.

But that but that that may win you a a Trivial Pursuit contest at some point. But in Kalingalinga, Zambia, Billy was was just a small church pastor in a very poor church that had been impacted greatly by the AIDS crisis. And they had, they had many, many children who were deprived of both parents and their community and many others that were on the, on the brink of orphanhood because of, you know, having one living parent and, and a, you know, an epidemic going on around him. And so to that, he just reached into the Word of God, honestly. You know, said that for all the programs that the government brought, for everything that relief organizations were trying to do, that, that it was God's people that really, bore the burden for orphan children in their community.

And so to put feet to that faith, he decided on a Sunday that he was going to preach out of James 127 and that he was gonna challenge their church to, to step in and to do something sacrificially to care for the orphans in their community. And what happened in that moment was, just a a a great outpouring of God's spirit and and you had people that were literally running home. There's a story of of someone who, you know, who got the one pair of shoes that they had, put them in the basket. There's a story of a widow who was actually taking care of a vulnerable child who was not, who was not related to her that went and got the last vegetables that she had, to eat and brought them and put them in the basket and just these, these incredible things, the way God's people were sharing. And so, we fast forward that about 15 years and now we have, you know, this thing that we've begun to do in the church every November called Orphan Sunday.

And so with that history lesson, VC, why, like, why is Orphan Sunday, why is that a time of significance for us in our churches in America? And and then maybe just extend that, as to how Lifeline churches or churches that partner with us can can use this Sunday to advocate for, vulnerable children and for vulnerable families.

Yeah. Really, you know, I think it's actually was about 20 years ago now. I think it's been, Orphan Sunday has been celebrated about 20 years now. It's been crazy to to see that, and it's taken a lot of some different iterations. There's some churches that call it different things.

Some call it there's this movement, kinda stand Sunday that's kinda more around foster care. There's some that'll call it adoption Sunday. I know Pure Religion Sunday has kinda been something that we've been hearing more recently. Christian Alliance For Orphans has kinda been using that moniker recently. But, you know, the the reality is it's a it's an opportunity for local churches, people of God to really just take at least 1 Sunday a year where they really just put the focus and the emphasis on the needs of the vulnerable.

We see all throughout scripture how clear it is that God has called his people to be the solution to the crisis of vulnerable populations. It's it's been that way from the very beginning when God first called his chosen people Israel and gave them the, the admonition that they were to care for the stranger, the sojourner, the orphan, the widow. And so it's really an opportunity for the people of God to say that, hey. We recognize that there are vulnerable populations that need our care, need our support, and we're gonna give the emphasis and focus on that. And so we're gonna take at least 1 Sunday a year where that's gonna be the heart of who we are.

For churches that have been doing this over a number of years, it's oftentimes an opportunity to kinda recalibrate, to reset, to kinda refocus, to make sure that, you know, in some churches, it's become just kind of a natural part of who the church is, which is really what we want. We wanna see churches where caring for the vulnerable is a natural part of their culture. And so for some churches, it that can when it becomes a part of the culture, it can almost become so commonplace that that it loses its focus and attention. And so Orphan Sunday provides the opportunity for those churches to really kind of retool, refocus, to continue to draw that importance to it. But for them churches that that this has not become a part of their culture and they want it to become a part, It's an opportunity to launch something new.

It's an opportunity to start that awareness. So really kind of wherever a church is at in that spectrum, Orphan Sunday provides a great opportunity for churches just to say, hey. This is something that matters to God. It matters to us, and we're gonna we're gonna make sure that we're giving you the attention to focus that it needs to really, move to to where God wants us to be in caring for vulnerable children and families.

So, pastor Chris, you know, as you just even think about what you're saying and and that movement that's underfoot and what an opportunity that it is, I think for so many times and and certainly, we wanna talk about Orphan Sunday. But you you've been a pastor. You've been in pastoral ministry. That's why we call you Pastor Chris. As a matter of fact, down in Florida, they think you're the greatest of all time, the GOAT, the Michael Jordan of all pastors.

And that's true. You can't deny it that that was said. But why is it so essential that we have a day, but did it not stop with just a day that it really become a part of the fixture of the word that's being preached on really any given Sunday?

Yeah. It's easy for us to to give one moment in time to anything, But if we're truly see the value and importance of it and the significance of of this being caring for vulnerable children, for orphan children, being a discipleship issue, which is really what we believe is the heart, God's word says that if we are a fully functioning disciple of Christ, this is gonna be a natural part of who we are as a believer. So if that's the case, it can be something that's fleeting that we just kind of toss a little attention to here and there every now and then. You know, you even look at the word in James 127. You were gonna look at the word visit.

In our vernacular today, visit is often something we can do at an arm's distance. We're gonna visit somebody. It means kinda, you know, I'm gonna stop by, pat them on the back, wish them well, and go about my business. And I think sometimes we even look at issues within the church in that same way and even this issue of caring for orphans in that way. It's something as long as we just mention it every now and then, as long as we kinda throw a bone out there, we kind of, you know, hold a drive every now and then or do something here and there, then we've done what we've been called to do.

But the reality is that that word episceptomy, the Greek word for visit, it means to join them, to come alongside. It literally means to examine closely, to look closely in, and you can't do that at an arms distance. You can't do that on one offs and one occasions. It involves getting yourself dirty with the dirt of those that you're serving, and it involves just kinda joining. And so it's gotta be something that's that's way more than something that we just throw a little attention to here or there, but it's gotta become a part of who we are.

And that's when we truly are living out the biblical mandate, the biblical call to care for the less fortunate, to care for the vulnerable.

Yeah. With your, you know, your $1,000 words you're throwing around there, it's kinda like a a Michael Jordan pass to Scottie Pippen. So before Pippen, doctor Rick comes up, talk to us a little bit about how do we take those cookies from the top shelf using these big words and and put them to the bottom shelf for churches to be able to say, hey. How can I take some resources Lifeline has and begin to use those?

Yeah. It's gotta be in a way that we've gotta make it practical for people. We've gotta make it easy for people to be engaged, to be involved, to feel like they have a part, to feel like they're doing something that matters. This is something that everybody's called to do, that there's a role for everyone to play, and so it becomes very, very much in a way that we've gotta simplify it. We we want churches to create the culture, but then also provide on ramps for people to get involved.

And so matter no matter what where people are in their own Christian walk and what their life looks like, there's a role to be played. Even as doctor Igg mentioned earlier, the church there in Zambia, I mean, they these were these were not wealthy believers. These were themselves probably could could be considered vulnerable in a lot of the sense that we look at it, but yet they said, what can I do? How can I get involved? How can I be a part of the solution?

And so we've gotta make sure that we're providing opportunities for everyone to be a part of of what God's called us to do.

Well, and we want to make sure that that's true, right? That everybody is a part. I mean, like, I was able to be a part today of checking off Pastor Chris used a Greek word on my bingo card. And so that was that was part of You

guys are not right.

So, so at some point, we, you know, like, I'm winning. But, so part of our ministry here at Lifeline, we want to come alongside the church, right? Like, we want to empower the church to do this work. We wanna stand behind the church and part of standing behind the church is providing resources that help a church to be able to to do this and to do it well. And and so as we're thinking about how we help churches, not just to tee up a Sunday where we have a celebration, but to build a culture, we're really intentional about doing both.

And and so maybe point to some things that folks can find easily in ways that that we can come alongside and and serve them that Lifeline is doing intentionally in order to equip church.

For sure. If you go to lifelinechild.org/orphandashSunday, you're gonna be able to get a whole resource kit that we've put together just to help with that. It it helps on a couple different levels. There's a whole piece of again, if if your church is you're just trying to figure out, how do I get my church involved? How do I get my people engaged?

There's some great just awareness tools that are there, things that you can in search, you can put in your bulletin, or, blurbs that you can put in your email newsletter, things that you can share on your social media. There's graphics that you can use on your screens. There's a simple lesson plan that you can use for children's ministry, for student ministry, for adults kind of at the different levels that are there. So a lot of just simple tools that you can find there as a part of that kit that can help you raise that awareness, help you get started. But then we also put in there some things to help you go deeper.

So there's a document there that's called 60 ideas for how to engage your church in Orphan Sunday that really can kinda help you know how do we involve our student ministry? How do we involve our marriage ministry? And what are ways and a lot of those things are things that you can do over a weekend, but also there are things that you can do that can kinda launch a movement. So there's things that you can do over the follow-up. One of the things that we really stress, if you're gonna do an orphan Sunday, you need to make sure that you have clear next steps and clear follow-up for your people so that it's not just a one off thing that you do.

And so we've tried to create some tools and resources to even help you kind of figure out what in your church context are those next steps. What are ways for people to get involved and get engaged? And and so we we try to make those things very accessible and very easy for you to get to.

Well and and I think, you know, we say this a lot, but our friend Johnny Carr is the one that kind of coined this term in his book. But one of the things we wanna make sure is that we're creating opportunities for everybody. Yep. For most people and then some opportunities that are just for you. Right?

And so we've tried to be really intentional in the things that we've built that we have all of those. So there are things that are accessible that there's no one that's too anything in the church. They're not too old, they're not too young, they're not too busy, they're not too anything in order to be able to do something. There are things that are really greatly accessible to most everybody and will, you know, use the gifts and talents and abilities and resources that a variety of people have in the church. But then we have, like, we have those things that only that only a few people are gonna do.

Right. Right.

Like adopting 7 kids, right?

Exactly. Exactly. Very few are gonna do that.

But truly, like, I think, that's the the heart that we wanna have behind this. And and you mentioned it earlier, you know, in the example that, that we take from Israel. When when we look at God's people, there was a bothand with regard to, you know, to the way that God led his people. He led them to to daily do things that were, exposing his heart to daily do things that were, you know, that were about caring for people in a way that put his character on display. But God also told the people to celebrate, to commemorate, to do things in a special way in order to to be able to focus.

And so that's that's really what Orphan Sunday is and the whole catalytic mindset behind this is that we do things that will endure and things that will be regular and things that will be typical, but most people find their way to something like that by celebrating, by doing things that are, you know, that are kind of atypical.

For sure. Starting very simple. I mean, even, one of the resources that we provide is a prayer guide. I mean, everybody can pray. Right.

And and you say, hey. You know, well, there's nothing I can do. I'm not called to adopt. I'm not called to foster. I don't I'm not at the season of life or stage of life to be able to do that.

You can pray. And so by starting there and then kind of moving and, you know, there's there's a there's a part of even pastoral ministry and discipleship where we meet people where they are and we start there. But as we're discipling and leading people, we don't want to leave them where they are. We wanna help them figure out what's the next step. And and so many many families even today who partner with Lifeline through adoption started off by praying for vulnerable children.

They started off by praying for the orphan. They started off by praying for a family in their church that was adopting. And then as they prayed, God gave them a greater burden to say, what can we do next? And maybe then it stepped into helping raise money for a family that was adopting or providing support and wraparound support for a foster adoptive family. And and as they did that, then God said, you know what?

I want you to go a little bit further. And now they themselves are bringing children into their home. And so we know that not every family is gonna follow that path and follow that journey. But as pastors, as leaders, as disciplers, we've gotta make sure that we're providing opportunities for people to get engaged where they are, but then also challenge them to pray and consider what would god have them do more, what would god have them do next. And I think even our churches in that way, we start off kinda raising that awareness, but then the more that we raise the awareness, the more God works in our hearts, the more that we see the needs, how clear they are, the more that we see ourselves as God's way of meeting those needs, then we start saying, what can we do a little bit more, and how can we go a little bit deeper?

So I think it's important absolutely to have kind of a diversity of next steps that are available to your people to kind of meet them where they are and then also challenge them to move a little bit deeper.

Pastor Chris, you know, you aren't only just the, you know, the one that promotes Orphan Sunday here. You're the one that has actually hosted Orphan Sundays. Yep. Again, let's go maybe for that church that's listening that says, these are all great things. We just don't have those types types of resources to be able to pull off ministry.

Maybe even a church planner who's going, yeah, we got about 20 to 30 people in our congregation. Talk a little bit more to some of those small churches or even to large churches that go, we got so much going on. This is just another thing. How is this something that can be utilized in both your church plant, to your small local church, to maybe even your megachurch?

Yeah. I mean, literally, the probably the first orphan Sunday that I oversaw and shepherd shepherded as a pastor was in a church plant that was about a year old, when we did our first one, and it was it was something that was totally new to us. We didn't even know about Lifeline at the time. We didn't know about a lot of different things, but we had a family in our church that was a foster family that we tried to love on. That opened the door for us to kinda say there's probably others in our community.

So we just kinda reached out to our local agency and said, how can we help you? What are things we need? And so we took a Sunday. I don't even know if I don't think we even the first way we even called it orphan Sunday because I don't even know if we knew about that term. But we took a Sunday that said, hey.

We want to we invited in local social workers. We wanted to honor adoptive and foster families in our community. So we just took a day where we said, hey. We're gonna have a luncheon afterwards, or we're gonna our our church we were a small church plant, but we were good at feeding each other, feeding people. So we said, hey.

We're gonna have a luncheon after the service. In the service, we're gonna invite foster families and adoptive families up, and we're gonna give them a small little gift. Thank you. I think we gave them, like, a gift bag. They had, like, a DVD and some popcorn and kind of an opportunity to have a movie night kind of thing.

And we also invited social workers, gave them a $5 Starbucks gift card. I think our total budget for that day was probably maybe $200, $300, something like that. And then we had people bring food, and we fed them afterwards and just thanked them for what they were doing. All the way fast forward as our church grew and as our experience and understanding grew, it then became, you know, a a bigger part of our church. Our church looked forward to it every year.

We would honor families, and we would honor social workers. We've been I've been a part of churches now that are multi side, multi campus churches. Some churches say we want it to look the same everywhere. Others that say we wanted to fit that campus' culture and that campus' context, and so they kinda have different things happening at different campuses. And and, again, it can be as simple or as elaborate as the church wants it to be, as the budget allows, but even if we had no budget whatsoever, just to spend time focusing on a biblical passage, that relates to this issue that shows and and there there are plenty of them.

Right? I mean, they're out there. They're easy passages to to see, but if it's just spending time in your service, focusing on that, spending time in prayer, So the smallest church can can step in and do this all the way to the largest church that has the most complex ministry model, but it's a great opportunity even in that larger church to raise up new volunteers, to bring awareness to people that maybe don't even realize that your church has a foster care ministry and adoption ministry, that it has families who have fostered and adopt. So from the smallest to the largest, there are things that can be done. And I think I I we've we've been able to see as a ministry orphan Sunday or or some type of a Sunday like an orphan Sunday.

We've been able to see it be catalytic in really moving the church to the next level, engaging churches, no matter what size, no matter what, their context is, and just really seeing God do great things as they've just been willing to shine a light and put attention on this issue.

Because that's really the goal. Right?

It is.

Like, we don't want a Sunday that we walk away from and don't think about it again until next year. We want

Absolutely.

We want a Sunday that's going to be catalytic and, you know, that's going to start something or it's going to encourage, you know, new life into something. And so, as we think about, as a ministry, Lifeline, like, that's why we exist, to come alongside churches and to provide those opportunities. And and so maybe in a in a very practical way, what are what are some of those next steps kinds of things that we've intentionally put together to be able to help churches to to bridge the gap so that Orphan Sunday does become an every week sort of thing.

Yeah. We even in the in the resources that you get in that resource kit, it even has a next steps page. And so it lists out here are next steps for individuals within the church. Here are next steps for families.

I may not know Greek, but I knew that we had a next steps page.

Got a next steps page. And here are next steps for your church as a whole. So so figuring out again and and I think it's great for churches to even delineate that out and say, if you're if you're an individual here today, here are things you can do. And on that next steps page, it has things like become a prayer partner, pray for the vulnerable, pray for for orphans in our community and around the world. It has things like become a monthly supporter of a ministry that in that engages in this, a ministry like Lifeline.

Become a a mess member of Vessel Hub where you're regularly supporting financially work that's being done. Then the as a family, a family can engage as a monthly donor. A family can can host a stand for orphans where their children get involved in, raising funds for orphaned vulnerable children around the world. Families can become support for other families within their church. They can become a part of a wraparound support group, a care community that that are supporting other foster adoptive families in their church.

Then you move into things that that maybe a small group could do together. You know, a small group in your church can wrap around a family and provide support and care. A small group can wrap around a teenager who is in foster care, who is about to age out and needs support, around them. A small group can wrap around a biological parent of a child in foster care or risk of going into foster care. So providing those opportunities for that.

And then what is our church gonna do? Do we need to launch a support ministry? Do we need to launch a Families Count ministry where we say we as a church are going to put energy and effort around coming alongside vulnerable families, the biological parents of kids in care? Do we, as a church, wanna step into, heritage builders where we can teach life skills to teens that are in the process of aging out of the foster care system? Do we wanna start recruiting women in our church who can receive mentor training and come alongside women who've experienced an unplanned pregnancy through the worthy program?

So so, again, those next steps are next steps for individuals that are clear and easy and simple, next steps for families, and the next steps for the church as a whole to get involved and get engaged as well.

Well, pastor Chris, I don't think anyone listening to this podcast thinks that you lack any passion for the church, for the church being engaged, or for Orphan Sunday. But if you could leave us today, like, and just take all of those things together, why do you get so excited about Orphan Sunday? Like, what's that central theme that you go, I'm grateful we get to be a part of this? And and maybe even, like, what's your prayer that orphan Sunday 2024 that it will how do you pray that it will be catalytic to the church this year?

I I think the thing that the reason that it's so important is because the church is the answer, and and the church, god has called his people. God God has promised to care for the vulnerable, but the means by which he does that is through his people. And and we get to be a part of what god is doing that is so much greater than anything that any one individual does, than any even one individual church does. This is something that's way bigger than any any one of us. And so by participating in orphan Sunday, we are saying, hey.

This is something that we collectively we in in the community, in a faith family that we see as vital, we see as important, but we also see as a privilege as something that God's doing that we get to be a part of. And so when churches host this, it's an opportunity to say, hey. We're we're we're linking arms together as a as an individual church family, but we're also linking arms together with other local churches because the church is the answer. The church is God's plan for getting the gospel to the world, and that includes getting the gospel to vulnerable populations. So when churches recognize that and see that and give it the energy and effort, then our people see that, our people get involved, and it truly has the power to transform the lives of the vulnerable around us and around the world.

And so my prayer is that as churches step into this, as churches engage, as churches host, an orphan Sunday or some kind of a focus, that more and more Christ followers are gonna say, hey. I've got a role to play, and they're gonna step into this. They're gonna dive in full throttle, and we're gonna see God do incredible things. I believe that vulnerable children will find family, will find home, will find community, and, ultimately, most importantly, find the gospel because churches in November of 24 are gonna step up and bring an awareness to this and preach on this and give opportunities for people to get involved. There are people right now, there are kids right now, there are broken families that are waiting for help, waiting for support, that are waiting for the gospel, and it's gonna get to them because churches are gonna bring attention to it, preach on it, and Christ followers are gonna step up, and God's gonna call them to action around this issue.

Amen.

Well, pastor Chris, The Michael Jordan of all pastors. It's been good, bro. We've we've

I love you to talk about this. Thank you for the opportunity to be a part of what God's doing here at Lifeline and and in churches that we partner with, and even churches that are outside the scope of Lifeline. I mean, we we our passion and desire our vision is that vulnerable children come to Christ and be discipled and disciple others. And, I'm excited to be a part of that.

And and we just wanna help. And, you know, the best way that we know to help for Orphan Sunday is by providing resources and and, you know, helping to create opportunities for the church to to be able to have this conversation in a way that is that's more effortless, right? And, and so you can find those resources if you go to lifelinechild.org backslash orphansunday. No dashes, just orphansunday.

It'll work if you put the dash in or you don't put the dash.

Wow. It will. We're we are with

This is the only website in Lifeline that works without a dash.

We are with or with it. No. Helen actually has banned the dash. Good. We're we're doing a great job of getting rid of the dashes.

But so lifelinechild.org/orphinsunday, and we'd love to hear what's going on with you and what your church is doing. And so, there also is an email address, info at lifelinechild.org, and and we'd, we'd love for you to, to be able to use that to tell us about things you've done, maybe creative things that you've put together for Orphan Sunday. It's always great for us to be able to celebrate with churches and to hear the, you know, hear the things that have happened and the things that god's done out there, and and it really helps to, you know, spark our creativity as well. And so we love hearing, things that people are doing because it's it's good, you know, growth for us as well. Absolutely.

So do that, share on social media, tag us. We'd love to hear that and see that as you're participating in Orphan Sunday. But as always, we're thankful that you've joined us on the Defender Podcast. We hope you'll join us back here again next week. Herbie and I might even be together next week.

You never know, or we might not. We'll see we'll see how the travel goes. Sometime in the next month or 2, we'll be back together again. But until that point, we'll be here every week, one of us, and, with great guests and, and talking about how we as the church, as the body of Christ can manifest the gospel to vulnerable children, through the ministry that God's given us, to take the gospel to the ends of the earth. And so, for Herbie Newell, I'm Rick Morton, and thanks for joining us on the Defender Podcast.

Thanks for listening to The Defender Podcast. If you enjoy making this podcast a part of your weekly routine, we'd love for you to take a moment to subscribe, rate, and review The Defender Podcast to make it easier for more people to find. For more information on how you and your church can partner with Lifeline, visit us at lifelinechild.org. If you want to connect with me, please visit herbienewell.com. Follow us at Lifeline on Facebook, Instagram, or Twitter by searching for Lifeline Child.

You can email us directly at info at lifelinechild.org. Beloved, will you allow god to use the gospel to you to impact the life of a child? Please contact us because we are here to defend the fatherless. We'll see you again next week for the defender podcast.