Welcome to the defender podcast, a resource to help mobilize and equip the body of Christ to manifest the gospel to orphans and vulnerable children. This podcast is a ministry of Lifeline Children Services, and I'm your host, Herbie Newell.

Hello again, and welcome to the Defender podcast. I'm Rick Morton. Today is May 29, 2024. And on today's episode, we're going to be talking about a new children's book entitled Whose Am I? The Truth About Your Worth and Identity in Christ.

We're going to be able to share an interview today with the authors of this book, Jackie Darby and Aixa De Lopez. They are have collaborated together to really create just a really heartwarming resource. The narrative of the story is really captivating. And it begins by introducing us to a character, Darley, pre adolescent girl navigating the complexities of her adoption story. And Jackie, her mentor and friend, who has a powerful testimony.

And this is actually taken from and drawn from Jackie Darby's actual story. And it takes into account Jackie's journey from being abandoned in a garbage dump to finding a loving family. And it unfolds through a touching exploration of the adoption experience. We really believe Whose Am I is a must read for adoptive and foster children, parents in similar situations, folks that are that are aspiring to adopt, and for kids that are seeking to understand the nuances of their adoption. And so we hope you'll join us for that discussion today.

Our guest, Aixa De Lopez is a graphic designer, writer, speaker. She's the wife of Alex and the mother of 4 children, 2, who came home through the miracle of adoption. She is a spokesperson for the Christian Alliance For Orphans in Latin America and is a board member of the Christian Alliance For Orphans. Eisha is a great friend and someone that we've gotten to know very, very well here at Lifeline and work collaboratively with her and their church in Guatemala. And so just really incredibly thankful to have them on the podcast today.

Jackie Darby in 1963 was a newborn abandoned in a garbage dump in Seoul, South Korea until one day a missionary nurse found her. Today, she's the mother of 2 adult children and a full time missionary with her husband of 35 years, Randall. Together, they founded the Start With 1 Global in Guatemala where they focus on encouraging and training leaders in various ways, to generate autosustainable resources so that they're able to impact communities with the gospel. And these two ladies are friends and collaborators and have have worked in ministry and worked alongside each other for years and just can't wait to delve into their story. But before we get there, we want to highlight this resource in this book.

And so we want to talk about whose am I or, de quinsoi as we, as it's titled in Spanish. And it's a bilingual children's book that shares the true life experiences about adoption, redemption and finding our identity in Christ. Because it's written for children and parents together, this book provides opportunities to discuss difficult topics such as abandonment and identity. We believe this book could be an excellent resource for any foster or adoptive families, as well as those who would like more insight into helping others find their identity in Christ. You can visit our Amazon store to purchase the book for yourself or purchase it as a gift for someone in your life that has adopted, someone who's been adopted, or maybe someone who's considering adoption.

You can find out more and see all the things that we recommend in our Lifeline store at lifelinechild.org/amazon. All right. So we are ready to jump in our interview and, and so I'm joined, by Jackie and Aixa and, and and we're gonna have just an incredible opportunity to be able to talk about this project, a little bit about them, and so friends, welcome.

Thank you.

Thank you so much, Rick.

We're so excited. So, I didn't give context in the intro to this, but we're actually together because the 2 of you are here because we're launching the book in the US today and Lifeline has the incredible privilege of being able to host that event. And so we're just, it's like a beehive of activity around here. People are flying around. We we kind of came over here in the studio to get quiet for a few minutes and be able to talk, but we're just so incredibly excited and thrilled about what the Lord has done through the 2 of you and just really thankful for our friendship and for the way that the Lord has given us an opportunity to be able to know one another and and to serve alongside one another in, you know, what is something that God has undeniably called us to do and to be part of in caring for vulnerable kids and vulnerable families.

And so, maybe, maybe where I'd like to jump in is, is let's just kind of start at the concept point and obviously in the intro, Jackie, I told a little bit just about the fact that this is this is really tied to your story.

Yes.

And so maybe if the 2 of you would just kinda talk a little bit about the inspiration for the book, what brought you to the place of, of really wanting to do this project and and sort of the heart behind it.

Well, thank you, first of all, for having us. It's a huge honor and privilege to be sitting here today. I I can't even believe it. It's so surreal. But the inspiration of the book, takes me back almost 30 years ago.

I had a dream one night, a literal dream one night, and it was so vivid. I'm I'm one of those kinds of people that don't remember my dreams. But I did get up the next morning because it was so vivid. The the details were very real, and I told my husband about the dream. And we never told anybody after that.

And, honestly, I didn't even know if it was a god dream. I wasn't even thinking in that realm because we are new missionaries. I had our first baby. We at the time, we were taking care of 10 orphan and abandoned teenagers, 17 throughout the first 8 years of our missions, field life. And so there was no time for any book, and it was never a desire in my heart.

But let's fast forward it. And my husband, throughout the years, always asked me, and what about the book? And what about the book? And I would be like, no time for a book. Didn't have any desire.

Super busy emissions life. But, in 2019, he challenged me and said, how are you ever gonna know if it's a God dream if you don't put your faith into action? And I was like, oh, wow. Okay. So that I like challenges.

And that challenged me to sit down at the computer and began to write my story and get my testimony in writing. And I I wrote it how I felt like I should write it, but it was really more towards older children.

Mhmm.

And once I got done with that, I had no idea what to do next. So I really believe that the Lord put Aisha in into my bind, because of our relationship that we've that I've known her before that point. Mhmm. And I called her. It was during 2020, COVID, full full blast into COVID.

And I said, would you mind coming to my house? I don't mind at all having people over if you don't mind coming over.

And I broke this number. I said, you don't even have

to wear a mask. We're okay. That's alright. Masks. Come over.

And she came over, and I shared my heart and my vision

Wow.

About the book with her. And so maybe you wanna share

Yeah. So, we met back when Jackie was just raising her babies and doing this whole teenager transition home thing. And I was single and very naive. And, having a small group of teenagers at my home, very, I mean, the lord is so gracious. I cannot I can't even remember what I taught in that group.

But, anyway, the lord redeems all things. And so we met there, and then fast forward, I'm married, and we have 4 kids and 2 by adoption and struggling with the little ones.

Yeah.

And my husband suggested to call Jackie up. Like, why don't the girls spend some time with Jackie? And I'm like, why didn't I think of that before?

That's awesome.

Because we weren't we were not tight. We we we, you know, we saw each other at church and we said hi, and we were very friendly with each other, but we weren't into a deep relationship. And so I said yes. And so, you know, they started going, you know, on play dates and, like, McDonald's and have, you know, the girls cook with her and stuff like that. And and so that began deepening our relationship.

And then we started during COVID

Mhmm.

A support group for adult adoptees.

Excellent.

And so and Jackie had also, lended her voice in the our summit that we do in Latin America. And so we saw that there was a very big hole in the whole orphan care movement. Even if, you know, we're starting out, I feel like in Latin America, but we don't give enough space for the adoptee Mhmm. To speak out because they do have a voice. Certainly.

We want them to

important voice. Right?

Super fundamental. Right. And so that's how we, like, started our relationship as friends. And then when I came over there and I and I, you know, heard her heart about doing this project. I said, yes.

I mean, I don't have many, many connections, but I do have important connections. I was already a published author by then. We had 2 books out and some other projects, going on. And so I I went I took her manuscript and just submitted it to 2 big publishers. And so they gave the fig feedback and Harper showed interest, but said, it's a very hard story and you need to rewrite it, because it's, you know, it had some, you know, realistic, and it's like and we didn't take that out.

Yeah. But then I I said to Jackie, okay. And she insisted from the beginning, I want you to illustrate it. And I'm like, I don't know if I can pull this off. I don't know if, you know, the time and the I I felt like but I can definitely get behind it and, like, revise it and help you out with it, any anything that I can't.

And so, anyway, Harper picked up the I rewrote it. And the way I thought about it was, well, Jackie already has used the story with my kids.

Right.

And far from being, you know, too impactful or disorienting or scary, it was deeply healing for them. So let's not underestimate the kids, and let's just approach it in a way that

is

safe and warm and friendly.

Mhmm.

And so I introduced my daughter into the story. And just so the the way the book is laid out and the way the story plays itself out is exactly how it happened

Yeah.

During those visits. Yeah. So you see Darlie coming in and and being nervous, and you can see I drew, you know, some of the pictures are about feet.

Mhmm.

So take a look at the shoes and the way they're positioned and, you know, they communicate something. She's nervous. And then, you know, Jackie's open and warm and inviting, and it takes place in the kitchen. Yeah. And so, that was a very safe way to for an adoptee.

It doesn't matter if he's 6 or if he's adult. Right. Somebody's telling the story. Mhmm. Somebody, which in this case, I use Zarlie's voice in the story to to express, feeling all sorts of emotions that are uncomfortable.

Right. And then maybe the child won't tell you mom or dad. Right. But my daughter's character in the story will. And so and then I started, like, in in we had a meeting with Harper.

They were very interested, and I probably should enter into the fact that Matt McGee, who's our publisher, we didn't know

that. Right?

We didn't know that. Maybe you wanna tell that part of the story, but he was going through an adoption process Right. With Lifeline.

Right. Right.

So we I didn't know that. And he wanted, like, we need this book. We need this book. And so he went on into it. And I the first meeting, I said, I don't think I have the time to illustrate it.

And he's he wouldn't say no for Nancy. He was like, no. Nobody's gonna have the heart for this as you. So I'm just, you're gonna do it. And I'm like

Literally, I just wanna give folks context. He's literally one of the nicest people on the planet. But the fact is that the passion that he had for this project and and the determination that he had to see this come to fruition is not to be underestimated. And so he may he may be one of the nicest people all of us all the 3 of us know, but he's also, one of the most bulldog determined people

Oh, yes.

That, you know, that we know as well. And so and and really, I mean, I I think, you know, his his role in this also needs to be celebrated, I think, in in a way that the Lord used him. But I I think one of the things that is that to me is just very interesting about the story and about the book and and I think will bring a layer of richness to people is is really understanding this backstory. I mean, for goodness sake, the Lord used the pandemic in the midst of this to to get the 2 of you to slow down enough to actually, you know, have this conversation. I think it's it's it adds a layer of impact to the book when you understand that this is not just a story that's that's fantasy.

It's not just it's not just a set of ideas that someone, you know, wove together, but it but Jackie, it's grounded in your story and it's grounded in in, you know, like your life and what the Lord has done, but then it's also grounded in in this relationship that you were able to form For sure. With Aisha's daughter. And and so, I'm just gonna tell you, like, knowing so I thought it was a great book when I when I picked it up and read it. And then when when Beth kind of came to me, Beth Perez, who's on our team, who who gave me a little bit of of a sense of the depth of what all was going on in the background of the book, I'm like, oh my goodness, this is this is God has orchestrated something together in this

Yes.

That, that He's let you live in order to be able to then, you know, craft it together and and share it.

Yes. For sure. I think, for me, that's one of the most special parts of this is that it's not just a make believe story. This is a real life story that happened and that God used Aisha's creativity. And I believe he put that into her her thought process that, hey.

Like she had said before, my story has touched the lives of her daughters.

Right.

So why not use that as the baseline? It's nothing we even have to make up. Right. A for real conversation that Darlie and I had in our kitchen one day when she came and visited. I was literally able to bring out my album that my mom made for me and show her the papers that that I had of my whole adoption process Wow.

And the photos and the conversation. This isn't a made up conversation. This is a real intimate private conversation that we had, and that's why I was a little oh my goodness. I don't know what she's gonna think. But because she was a minor Mhmm.

And things there were certain things of our conversations that I felt like, Aisha, as the mom, she's the one who's going to be ministering to her child

Right.

That this would be helpful information for her to understand, as God leads her.

Mhmm.

And so our our book, is a real life story of a real conversation that was that God was using, the story that he wrote in my life Mhmm. To help her to understand, some of the things some of the feelings, not pretty feelings

Right.

That she had been experiencing that I totally could identify with. So our heart is that the children who read this story or like I should said, even adults. I don't care how old you are. All of us in this world face the time where we question our worth and identity.

100%. Total. 100%.

And so, it doesn't matter what the age. I know it's a children's book, but I think it's more, it's easier to read as a children's book.

Right.

But I think the message is for everybody.

Well, and that's that is something that I think that that's important for us to, you know, talk about. Because I because I do think the way that you came to tell the story is is very disarming. It's very it it it's it it really it it's it's and for and as as an adoptive parent, this is intimidating. Right?

Yes.

It's like to know how to know how to to have these conversations with our kids and even how to get there to begin them.

Exactly. Yeah. We we really wanted to put out a resource that parents felt accompanied by.

Right.

Like, we're not I've said it in other spaces, but we're not trying to throw you to the bulls. We wanna get because it's like, you know, some adoptive parents, especially in Latin America, because it's a bilingual book.

Right.

And it and it is bilingual because we wanted it to be wider spread. And they feel intimidated and sort of, like, defensive if you talk about the biological parents too much or the biological story the the origin story too much, it's gonna be, you know, uncomfortable and even negative. And and we have wrongly believed that any unpleasant feelings are not God glorifying.

Right.

And so we have a pickle. We have a problem with, actually letting, sitting with pain. We have a problem with that. So the book wants to sit with you. We wanna sit with you there.

And, you know, we I use my daughter's character in the book to say, that feels awful. Mhmm. I feel, you know, sad. And Jackie says, that is shame. That is, you know, pain.

That is so we name things. And I that I wanted to bring that into the book, the the trauma informed voice of your body feels things. And it's telling you that the that this is not the way it's supposed

to be. Keeps score. Right?

The body keeps the score, and I wanted the kids to know, hey. Yeah. The tingly, you know, feeling I get in my hand is telling me that it's not okay. Mhmm. And it's fine.

Yes. You the Lord made you to be protected and loved and not be separated, And this is why it does it does not feel good.

Right.

And so for adoptive parents, that's, I think, very liberating to understand that it is proclamating that we are made to be loved and protected and not separated.

Right.

This is not plan a.

Right.

And it's good. It's fine.

Right.

We are a redemptive measure Absolutely. Of the Lord. Absolutely. And our kids are entitled to their pain.

Right. And and and and we don't wanna minimize that. Right? Like, we we wanna but but we want to but we wanna

Acknowledge it.

Acknowledge it and do it in a way that's that's good and healthy and and together. And I think one of the things that is, you you know, that that just as I've looked at the book and as I've I've read through it and so I'm gonna I'm just gonna I'm gonna pitch an idea here and see if I'm right. So it's very obvious to me that this is a book that was written with the intention of of children and parents, you know, reading reading this and experiencing this book together. Right?

Yes.

Well and and again, like I said, I think as an adoptive parent, those are those are just intimidating conversations to have. But, but I'm gonna take my adopted parent hat off for a second and I'm I'm gonna put my developmental psychology hat on, you know, for a moment and and say that that one of the things that we that we know that is is so important in our development and in our understanding of our identity is all of us at some point need, what David Elkind called a significant other adult. That there's this outside of the relationship with her parents, that it's really important for for us to have someone who's who's not her mom and dad to just kind of be that, you know, that sounding board, be that,

you

know, that adult who who the, you know, we can be a little more transparent with and a little more unburdened and and are, you know, and you're not talking to the person who's gonna discipline you or the person that you feel, you know, that that maybe you don't wanna share

Exactly.

Things with. And and so what I found in this book is for a lot of us that that maybe there's not an adult adoptee in in our life that could be that significant other adult for our child.

Yes. For sure.

This book really stands in that gap and gives the opportunity for parents and kids to to be able to have that reference point without having to have a third person in the relationship. And I I just wanna say to you and I wanna say both of you just like, I'm so appreciative. Oh. I'm so thankful, that you told your story and that you that you exercised this kind of vulnerability to do this because I think it's so important for for the people that come behind you. And and so on behalf of all those people, let me say thank you.

But is that am I on am I on to something there?

Yes. Thank you. We're honored that you would even say that. And I it's confirmation to me, to us, why we feel like the Lord put it in our hearts to to share my story and then to share it through a story

Mhmm.

A real story of what truly happened. And I believe that there are 2 very distinct perspectives, the adoptive parent, foster parent, or and the child's perspective, an adopt adopted child's perspective. And you can have 2 very distinct different perspectives. Neither are wrong. Right.

Because my parents 100% seen my story as a huge testimony Sure. To God.

Sure.

That's why they went around telling everybody who even looked at me.

Right.

Because, clearly, we could tell by the look that, they could tell that I was not birthed by them. And so that that created curiosity. Sure. They want to know, when did you get her? Mhmm.

I heard that question so many times. When did you get her? To my in my perspective

Right.

That wasn't a very pretty question because I kinda felt like, you know, you say, when did you get your puppy? When did you get a thing? You know? Mhmm. And so to my ears that were, talking from a child's perspective who, was very dysfunctional in my thinking, I didn't hear it from the perspective that my parents told it.

Right.

And so until the lord came into my my life and began healing me in those areas, I heard it from a very distorted perspective, but yet my feelings were real.

Mhmm.

And I believe that's why, Aisha so creatively brings out those feelings and and illustrates them because we want the child to understand those are real, and they need to be validated Right. And to be told that that's okay. But don't just bury them like I did. Right. I hid them.

Right.

Somebody just asked me, like, when did you process them? Did you process your feelings as a child? No. I did not. I don't even know I didn't even know they were there because I purposely buried them so deep Mhmm.

Because I didn't wanna go there. It was painful, and I felt like nobody would understand me. So why waste my time even talking to somebody? But this gives a not a simple, but a a way, an avenue to be able to open that conversation, an honest conversation, to go to that point, allow the child to express their feelings and to because if there's an adult, the parent listening or or a family member Mhmm. They're going to have to listen to the answers.

Right. Yep.

And, hopefully, it will create good dialogue on both sides.

Right.

Exactly. And I think one important, aspect of the book is that we have been very, very intentional in structuring it in a way that feels like you are on a journey and you get to pause. And so we explicitly have the pause and think pages where you go through a portion of the story, you stop, and you say pause and think, and we have a helpful question.

Mhmm.

And both parent and child can answer that question, and they can discuss it a little bit or not, and then a prayer. Mhmm. And you can pick up tomorrow or the next week or whatever, and then go, you know, the next station.

I love that rhythm.

Yes.

Right? Like, it just it's so so you you may, you know, you may encounter something heavy, and but then then you sort of get to come up for air. Right?

Yes. Yes. That's the idea. That's the idea that we that we, help you out. Because if we had just, you know, put the story out there, it would have been good because, you know, we we I wrote in a way that it's, you know, not palatable, but at a child's level Right.

Appropriate. Right. But then when we wrote Jackie wrote many of the the prayers herself. And so that is that is so valuable because you have a grounding. You have a a place to, you know, just sit down and and think of the Lord and the truth of the Lord every step of the way.

And that is, like, the the basis of the story. Like, we would not have, and it's not a happy ending. It's it's it's an open ending.

Right.

But it's a it's an ending that has the eyes our eyes placed on the eternal, placed on Jesus. And Mhmm. And that's what we wanted. You know? Because it's not, you know, And I did write that on purpose when when Jackie says to Darley, you know, the storms may not ever, end.

Mhmm. You know, because she the I gave her the words of, I feel a storm in my stomach.

Mhmm.

And so at the end, you see Jesus calming the storm.

That's right.

You know? And it's not all gone. Right. But he's there.

Right.

And she you know, and they're together, Jackie and and my daughter. And and the fact that you say that you we need another person to in in words in our own psychological words, to regulate. We need we need coregulation. That's powerful. And and the fact that a mom can step aside and and say, maybe I'm not gonna be that person.

Yeah. Maybe my child will need somebody. Pray. I'm gonna be bold and say, moms, pray for somebody somebody to step into your children's lives and speak truth.

That's right.

And let your child know that it's okay. They don't have to sneak to sneak around to talk to somebody Right. To feel safe. I've told this to my kids. I don't care if it's not me that's telling you the truth about the gospel, about a situation.

I'm praying for you guys to have other voices

That's right.

Other than mine. And I realize some of the deepest spiritual experience that you'll have will not be with me, and that's okay because it's not about me.

But but speaking from the the adoptive parent perspective, I think one of the lies that we buy into is, we've we've missed something already. We've missed, like and and so and so there's this there's this I think there's this deep thing that kind of triggers when that within us sometimes that it's like, I don't I don't wanna share that with somebody else because I've because I've I've missed so much already. Yeah. And and I just think that's that's that's confusion that the enemy is sowing. That's that's ultimately rooted in a lie that that somehow our role as as parent, our role as as, you know, mom or dad is is somehow lessened because because other people are are being used in our child's life.

And and and the truth is the story of the gospel is is about Jesus, you know, bringing a community to himself. It's about it's about, you know, us being reconciled together and and and our our the reality that we're brothers and sisters and and all of that. And I think just I just I appreciate the really healthy way that that you you walk through the example of that and and just wanna encourage the, you know, the folks that are listening to us to to say, you know, maybe one of the things that you want to evaluate is even as you use this book as a resource in your relationship with your child, that there there are going to be things that you're gonna hear that are gonna be difficult and gonna be hard. There are gonna be things that you're gonna walk through and talk about that are, you know, that are gonna expose things that are gonna gonna be hard. And and bringing someone else into into that conversation is a is a good thing.

And that's not only for our child, it's also for us.

Exactly. And as a mom, I mean, even with my own daughter, who's not adopted, You know, I've told my daughter that when you talk to me, I am your mom. Mhmm. I I can't step away from that. I'm listening with mom ears.

That's right.

I have a mother's heart. So there's some things, like, I'm not your your buddy. Right. I'm not your girlfriend.

Right. Mhmm.

Or or an another mom who's disconnected. Right. And so I said, you need people in your life who can hear some things. Of course, please always feel free. The door is 100% open to come to me.

Sure. But there's times that the Lord wants to use other people to speak into your life. Mhmm. And sometimes I laugh because she'll come and tell me a conversation. I'm thinking, that's what I've been telling you.

Absolutely. But I'm glad you heard it from somebody else. 100% of your percent. That's why I really I wanna emphasize. I really appreciate Aisha because I said this is just as much your story, and there's a hidden message in our book.

Yep. As much as my story and Darley's story, because her as the adoptive mom, she was secure enough Yep. To say, we're really having a challenging time. I need help, and I wanna look for that help that somebody else could can encourage or minister to my daughter or I've not been able to.

That's right.

So she gave me permission. If I didn't have that permission, there would be no story.

Right. Right.

There would be no story. And so I wanna encourage adoptive parents to die to that fear. Yep. Because like you said, that's just a lie of the enemy. Mhmm.

Allow others of course, we need to be wise in who we choose.

Yeah. Sure.

Absolutely. Because of privacy in the sense of you know, it's a sensitive matter. You don't want somebody going out Yeah. Talking about the stories. But to allow somebody else into your child's life who could maybe speak truth.

Mhmm. And that took time. We had to build a relationship. We had to spend time together.

Sure.

We are very my husband and I, we love relationships. Mhmm. It's not just all about, bring him in and Mhmm. Hit him with it. You know?

Let's build a relationship. Let's spend time together. And then little by little, as god permitted, I I was able to speak truths into her life. And part of the truth I mean, my I wouldn't be sitting here today if it wasn't for my faith and and the lord, what he's done in my heart and life. And so that's why we did pause and think.

Okay. Let's go to the Lord. Mhmm. Let's invite him into this Right. Problem Right.

Into these emotions.

Right.

Because he is the only one who can give us that peace and fill that void in areas that not even, you know, a person can really do. Mhmm. God can use the person. Sure. But he wants to give that supernatural peace and calm those fears and those all those doubts.

I mean, I still have a lot of unanswered questions in my mind. Sure. But I have peace now. The questions never went away. They're still there.

Yeah.

But I have peace. I don't have to have the answer anymore because I know God has the answers.

That's right.

And so that's what I've done in in our relationship with Darlie and I is try to, little by little, lead her to our heavenly father. That's where we're rooted.

That's right.

That's where identity even far above our earthly parents and Mhmm. God love our adoptive parents. I wouldn't be here without them either, but it was all orchestrated by our heavenly father. 100%. Amen.

And and we can't, right, we can't forget that. I I think one one last thing that I wanna I would I just kinda wanna say and I and I feel like it's for the folks that are listening. The the other the other thing that I think needs to be said as an adoptive parent, you you may have the opportunity to be that significant other adult for somebody

else. Exactly.

And so the road that you're walking and and really in in a in a difficult you know, this is this is all sort of, it's hard, right? And and so at times where you're really feeling like you're not able to be everything that you want to be for your child, one of the really great things that God can can do with us and for us at times is to give us the opportunity to be something for someone else in a different way. And and I think that, you know, many times in in this whole, you know, journey toward healing and and and the we we we become so preoccupied and we become so focused on ourselves and our own family and the resources that we're bringing around and the people that we're bringing around. Don't forget that the Lord may be ready to use you and the experiences that you've had and the journey that you've been on in order to to be that significant other adult for another child or that or that significant friend to walk with a parent because you know.

Exactly.

And because you understand. And so, you know, thank you for just exposing that and and really, you know, elevating the level of this conversation. One thing I I don't wanna I wanna make sure before we, you know, finish our conversation today that I'll because we've talked about a lot of, you know, just really a lot of heavy things and about the the fact that the book really provides a vehicle for that to to deal you know, to get into the heavy. There's also some really fun things in the book, and one of them is my little buddy Nacho. Right?

I'm just I'm just I'm just taking Nacho into my heart. Right? Like, so there's so there's like a there's already like a personal relationship. So we were sitting here looking at pictures earlier and, and one of the things that y'all surprised me with today is that we walked in and sitting here on the table was a little plushie of nacho. And, and so one of the fun things that's coming is, is that you're actually gonna be able to get a plushie of Nacho.

Yes. And, and that can be part of your experience with the book. But just but the reality that, you know, that there are those those little things that sort of are unexpected through the story and provide some humor and.

Exactly. That's another very, very intentional way of, of, approaching the story, the surroundings. You know, it's a kitchen, and they're baking cookies.

Right.

And you get the recipe. You get the and I'm gonna say, don't get jealous, but if you came to the launch and Rick, Rick, listen.

I'm so excited.

Jackie flew into Dallas on you know, 4 days early to bake.

Right.

She baked almost 200 cookies.

I heard.

And so we have her friends.

And then they Yes. Last Tuesday, you just bake

them, but wrap them.

Yes. So she that's a kind of that's a kind of Right. You know, mom that she is because she's like a mom figure to all of us. I said, I I really I just can't think of a launch without the cookies. Right.

And she's like, okay. I'm gonna bake, you know, and and then pack them. So we had a carry on, a 100% packed with only cookies, freshly baked. And we got through Dallas airport with them, and then

I'm just imagining the TSA experience. I'm just gonna

have a

moment just My husband, they Yeah. He did get stopped. He did get stopped. And they were like, what's in here?

Cookies.

Cookies. Yes. And you have to know that Randall Darby is the manliest man around, and he wears, like, you know, his, you know, army stuff. And he's, like, he's the the one in charge of the cookies. And it's like so, anyway, we we really were very intentional in in inter like, weaving together the, you know, nachos, like a comic relief Mhmm.

And then the cookies. And we wanted to exemplify how you have these conversations. It's not like we need to talk Right. And then straighten the eyes. You're side by side.

You're touching other things. You're, you know, being interrupted by a puppy, and you're doing life, and then you talk. Mhmm. And the fact that we, suggest even if you can't get the plushie, because we are working towards having him around, but we're building him live events.

Live events.

Alright.

Yes.

Hey. So that what that means is

They have to come tonight.

Come come tonight or come to one of the live events. Right?

Yes. Exactly. He's traveling with us.

There you go.

Yes.

Well, I was very excited to see that and I think that that's like one of the coolest things that is a part of this. Well, let's talk about so so we're we're talking about the live event tonight and and the launch of the book, but, obviously, you didn't you didn't write this book. You didn't go through this project in order to just put it out there and and for it not to have impact. And so what are we praying for? Like, how do we how do we wanna see the Lord use this and and, what's the, you know, what's the dream?

Cut us in on that.

Wow. That's a good question. There's lots of answers. We're praying for a lot of different things. But, first of all, we are praying that this book is a powerful tool in the hands of any adult who reads it with their child to open up sometimes difficult and complicated conversations, but it's a tool that they can read through the book with the child and have very real, honest conversations throughout a week's time.

It's nothing that they have to digest all in one night, that they can do it little by little. And our prayer my prayer is that every child, every adult who reads teenagers as well, everybody in between, that as they read this book, that they realize the truth about their identity and worth in Christ, that we have a heavenly father. He loves us. Every life matters Mhmm. To God, and that our true identity and worth is rooted in him.

I know in this day and age, Rick, I believe the world is in an identity crisis right now.

Absolutely.

And instead of waiting till we're adults Mhmm. To figure out who we are Mhmm. Why not in Sunday school, in at our homes, in schools, wherever this book is is on the shelf Mhmm. That kids begin to realize at a young age who they are and not have to wait Yeah. Until they're older.

Like I said, all of us deal with identity issues, But to learn at a very young age who we are, and especially for adopted and foster kids who I believe raises that up Sure. Many notches, notches because we don't understand most of the time our biological, how we came into this world, that we really understand that through the message of Christ.

That's right. Yes. That's right.

Yes. Amen. Amen. To all of that. I mean, I second every word that Jackie just said, and I pray for.

All of that. And especially for adult adoptees that never had a chance to, to be validated and to wrestle and to cry in public about how painful it is and to not be stuck there.

Yeah.

To pray and then to be just thrown into God's arms and and and really just embrace that you're loved. Just last night, we were at the hotel lobby, and then the lady that was there, I didn't even notice her when I came in because there's a a slew of people there. And and so we were talking about the book, and then she then I I waited by myself a little bit with one of your relatives, Jackie, and then she comes to me and says, I want that book. I heard you talking, and I was adopted.

Wow.

And I'm like, you you got it. We're gonna give you a book. And so, you know, so much, that can, be brought about with a tool like this. And so, you know, it I think it was CS Lewis that said a a a worthwhile kid's story is actually for adults. Adults will be interested and and passionate about a good story.

That's right.

If it's only a kid's story, it's not good at all.

So I was gonna make the I was gonna make the comparison, and this is this is a pretty high bar. So I just want you to know. But but when I really after, you know, after working through Whose Am I, it it I think of it on the same par as as like the Jesus Storybook Bible Oh, no. As as because I mean, here's the here's the reason. Because, you you can use that resource with adults and it's it's deep and it's meaningful and and it and it resonates.

And I think what what the Lord's used the 2 of you to do is to create something that the story is transcendent.

Mhmm.

And it doesn't matter who you are and where you are, there's there's something for you. And it all points you back to, Jackie, just exactly what you said, which we're we're created in the image of God. Yes. And and we're created worthy and and with,

you

know, dignity and worth, and and all of that is rooted in

Yes.

You know, ultimately in the person of Jesus.

Yes.

And, and so we want folks to go get this book, we want folks to buy it for themselves, we want them to buy it for friends, we want them to make sure that it's in, you know, their their church libraries and in the places where kids are gonna be. And we're just unashamedly saying, look, we we want you to just go out and buy a slew of these. And and part of the reason for that is, and I'm just gonna be as, you know, as as an author to author for a second, I'm just gonna say, you know, the thing that that the Lord uses in our world and and in our reality to see more good things like this produced is the fact that the good things that are already produced sell. Yeah. And that's something we probably don't want to talk about, but it's but it's like that's the reality.

And so I'm encouraging folks, this is not the 2 of you, this is me saying, go out, go grab it. We've made it really easy for you. If you go to lifelinechild.org/amazon, it's in our store. It's featured right now, but you can pick it up on Amazon. You can find it in bookstores.

You can, you know, there are tons of ways that you can put your hands on the book. But go do that. Give it to somebody else. And I pray that maybe, you know, a year or 2, 3 from now, something we'll get back together at some point. And, I'd love to be able to then talk about the stories of what it is that God's done.

A testimony. And how it

is that God used this, you know, for his glory and and for the for the good of, the people.

Amen. Yes. Thank you.

Thank you so much, Rick.

Absolutely. Friends love you. Thank you.

Thank you.

We appreciate you.

We we feel so incredibly honored, to get to be part of this and and to have just a little bitty small part in, in hosting this event tonight. And Thank you. But we're but thanks for thanks for allowing us to, hitch a ride.

Thank you so much. Sally Lloyd Jones, if you ever hear this, I love you. You're you're one of my heroes.

All of us. Right? Like, that's, you know, absolutely. Well, Sally, if you're out there and you're listening to the Defender podcast, I'm not audacious enough to think so. But if you know Sally, then put this podcast in her hands and and ultimately, please get her to get in touch with Aixa because

Yes, please. There's there's

there's a there's a need there.

Yes. Little bosses, she calls children. So I have little bosses now, and I love it.

That's awesome. Well, hey. Thanks again for joining us for another episode of the Defender Podcast, and we look forward to seeing you back here again next week as we consider continue to consider what the Lord has called us to do in the lives of orphan and vulnerable children and families for his glory.

Thanks for listening to the Defender Podcast. If you enjoy making this podcast a part of your weekly routine, we'd love for you to take a moment to subscribe, rate, and review the Defender Podcast to make it easier for more people to find. For more information on how you and your church can partner with Lifeline, visit us at lifelinechild.org. If you want to connect with me, please visit herbynewell.com. Follow us at Lifeline on Facebook, Instagram, or Twitter by searching for Lifeline Child.

You can email us directly at info at lifelinechild.org. Beloved, will you allow God to use the gospel through you to impact the life of a child? Please contact us because we are here to defend the fatherless. We'll see you again next week for the Defender podcast.